tv The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell MSNBC October 2, 2014 10:00pm-11:01pm PDT
temperatures twice a day, checking in with each other. and if any one of us suddenly spikes a fever or gets symptoms, we will report ourselves to the authorities. we are taking it seriously, but but the breaking news is that an nbc news freelance cameraman has contracted the ebola virus and will be the fourth american patient flown from liberia back to the united states for treatment tonight. that does it for us tonight. see you again tomorrow. now it's time for "the last word" with lawrence o'donnell. thanks for being with us. the man who started our never-ending war in iraq had something to say about that in a rare appearance on fox news this morning. and charles blow is back here on "the last word" this time with a
powerful new book filled with shocking revelations about how he made his extraordinary life's journey from literally eating dirt in rural, louisiana, to his position now as a columnist for "the new york times." but first, the parents of jordan davis are here for an exclusive interview about the conviction of the man who murdered their son. >> the shooting death of jordan davis. >> over loud music. it's senseless. >> we will not stop until we get the type of justice we deserve. >> the jury in the michael dunn murder trial. >> deadlocked on the murder charge. >> i will declare that mistried. >> angers and disbelief that they could not agree on a first degree murder charge. >> a blow to the victim's family. >> we will not stand by and let you use the law to kill our
young black boys. >> justice wasn't done for jordan. >> and we will continue to wait for justice for jordan. >> his community demanded a new trial. >> breaking news in the retrial of michael dunn. >> we the jury find the guilty of first degree murder. >> this was a new trial with a new outcome. >> race, justice and florida's stand your ground law. >> yesterday in a florida courtroom, a clerk read the verdict in the retrial of michael dunn accused of murdering jordan davis because he was playing music too loud. >> we the jury find the defendant guilty of first degree murder of mr. dunn. we find the defendant discharged a firearm causing death. >> after that verdict was returned, the prosecutor angela
corey side this. >> we thought michael dunn's flight to avoid fros accusation would be the most striking thing about this case and hopefully that's what convince this jury. if you are defending your life you don't b then run from the scene. you give these officers a chance to do their job fairly. >> joining me now once again for an exclusive interview, jordan davis' parents. thank you both very much for doing this today. i know how difficult it is to continue to have to talk about this. but lucia, what was it like in that moment yesterday in that courtroom when you heard that clerk say that word -- guilty. >> complete jubilation. in fact, i think i threw my head back and just a tremendous sigh of relief. i just couldn't believe it. absolutely just overjoyed.
>> ron, there's usually a sense among trial observers, the lawyers who were in the courtroom, they have a feeling about which way it's going. they tend to have a feeling about which jurors they feel they connected with. as you were awaiting this verdict, were you leaning toward the expectation that it would be guilty or that it would be not guilty? >> i thought in reality, they would waiver between second degree murder and manslaughter. so i was prepared for the manslaughter charge. but i knew in my heart the prosecutors did a much better job this time around. a much clearer job this time around, and that they illustrated that there's a difference between doubt and reasonable doubt. and because they made the difference and they showed that to the jurors, they had more to work with because when the defense attorney keeps hammering to them that they should have
some type of doubt because of michael dunn's mindset at the time. they keep hearing that word doubt. so they have to know what is reasonable and what is not reasonable. so because of the great job that the state attorneys office did, i believe that we could get a conviction this time. >> yeah. that's not uncommon that in the retrial, the side with the better case actually presents it better because they've had a rehearsal in effect with the first trial. and the side with the bad evidence doesn't have any better evidence. i'm wondering if during the trial, you could see any -- if you had these moments of sensing that certain elements of the evidence were landing with this jury better. >> absolutely. i think there was far more clarity in the rebuttal this time. i think our team was able to really know in advance they were, they were better prepared
to expect what the defense would throw at them. they've been don this road before. so we're just very grateful that they seemed to be far more intuitive this time to what they could expect from the defense. >> it was a very emotional day for you yesterday. i saw your comments after the trial yesterday. ron, is there anything you would say to michael dunn now if you could. >> i would say that you definitely have to understand that it is unlawful to discharge a weapon when you imagine someone has a weapon. when you imagine someone is attacking you when no one touched your car, no one touched a hair on your head, no one has violated your space. and for you to imagine that these young men, good young men were thugs within seconds of getting to the station.
for you to imagine all this and imagine your fear and to take action and end lives and try to shoot at these young men, and also say on the stand that it was okay for you to even shoot 50 rounds at these young men. for you to even say that, it shows me that you for some reason, you have a thing about society where lives of other people don't mean anything to you. and i think this verdict of first degree murder proves to you that in society, black lives, white lives, any kind of lives in america, human lives, they do mean something to all of us. >> lucia, what do you think michael dunn saw in your son jordan that sanctioned him in his mind to do this, to pull that trigger, to aim that gun at him? >> i think he had preconceived notions of who young black males are.
i don't think he had much exposure to young black males and often times people have a fear or a reluctance to be around those people they don't know, they don't understand, they don't really live in their environment. so i think he had preson kooef -- preconceived notions when he pulled up. just the fact that he said i hate that thug music, already labelling those boys as thugs, not even knowing who they were. had it not even been those boys, i believe that michael dunn had that preconceived notion about any young black male. >> ron and lucia, you both have decades ahead of you of life without your son. a life you expected to live with your son. you've gotten through the legal process now. you've gotten justice for your son. what do you expect it's gong to be like now without that
particular crusade, the justice for your son in front of you every day. and now just that life without him in front of you every day. >> i think first of all that across the nation, we should realize, and i don't think we have yet, that this is an historical moment in our society for this decade that we have a majority 10 to 12 majority white jury, majority men on the jury, seven men on the jury. and they are indeed a jury of michael dunn's peers. and even with that, even with maybe their biases that they may have as far as culture is concerned. maybe not connecting with jordan and his culture, but we can still have a society where we can depend on them and count on them to render a verdict based on the facts of the case and the witnesses that they hear and not
on any biases that they have. so i'm elated that we have this time. i think it's something for the history books. i think it's something that our young people all across this nation should understand and view, that this is really great for our nation, that we can maybe have a start of having justice and making sure that justice is equal and we don't have to worry about the makeup of the jury. i joined the human rights network, and we go to different places around the country where there's violations of human rights and i know there's a lot of people that have been unable to attain the justice that me an lucy have for our son. so immediately i'll be going to valdosta, georgia, to help with kenneth johnson and his son kendrick johnson and the problems they're having down
there with getting justice for their son. and there are so many others that i would like to speak on behalf of them. and it's just about equality and justice for everyone. it doesn't matter what the skin color is. what matters is everyone deserves to be able to bury their loved ones with the notion and with the thought that they will receive justice from the united states of america. >> lucia, does this verdict help you in what are the decades ahead of you in your life getting through them, getting through all those days without your son? >> as ron said, we really believe that our verdict has set a precedence for many, many, many individuals that have never received any justice and have had similar cases to ours. pertaining to the stand your ground legislation. i am eagerly looking forward now beyond the verdict to the work that i will do as a gun safety advocate. i am going to be taking a larnler role with every town for
gun safety. moms demand action which i'm the national spokesperson for, along with mays against illegal guns. i will now eagerly work with them, trying to change the laws and keep so many other individuals from dying from these senseless, senseless crimes. >> luca mcbath and ron davis, once again i'm very sorry for your loss and thank you for joining us tonight. >> thank you very much. >> thank you. coming up, charles blow will join me to tell you just how close he came to a fate like jordan davis, which is just one of the remarkable stories in his new book. and what president bush had to say about president obama and iraq today and in "the rewrite" stephen colbert's feelings are hurt after bill o'reilly's feelings were hurt after something stephen said about bill.
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watch this. sam always gives you the good news in person, bad news in email. good news -- fedex has flat rate shipping. it's called fedex one rate. and it's affordable. sounds great. [ cell phone typing ] [ typing continues ] [ whoosh ] [ cell phones buzz, chirp ] and we have to work the weekend. great. more good news -- it's friday! woo! [ male announcer ] ship a pak via fedex express saver® for as low as $7.50. >> president bush was asked this morning if president obama should have anticipated the war going on forever. >> the military recommended that we leave a residual force of 10,000 to 15,000, maybe more.
did you feel the same way? >> i did, yeah. the president has to make the choices he thinks are important. i'm not going to second guess our president. i understand how tough the job is. and to have a former president bloviating or second guessing isn't good for the president or the country. he and his team will make the best informed decisions they can make. but i agreed with general dempsey's assessment. >> joining me now phyllis, what's your reaction to what president bush had to say this morning. >> my reaction to president bush's bloviating? it was rather extraordinary. he was trying to rewrite history. you would think it was president obama rather than president bush who signed the withdrawal order to bring home the troops. in fact, it was president bush who signed that agreement with iraq. president obama actually tried to renegotiate and arrange to
keep more troops in iraq, but it was the iraqi parliament that said no dice. we want you out of here. and it was for that reason the u.s. troops were pulled out. so this was a rather extraordinary rewriting of history. >> and the interview, of course, proceeded with the conventional wisdom that of course, iraq is better off now than before bush invaded iraq. >> this is one of those historical, well, everybody knows. everybody doesn't know, and i think particularly the ones who don't know are iraqis who are facing the consistency of violence, the consistency of renewed u.s. bombing. the consistency of a sectarianism at a greater level than ever before that is the direct result of the u.s. invasion and occupation of iraq. it's not the result of the pellout of troops. it's the result of troops having been sent in in the first place. >> let's listen so to the what dick cheney had to say. >> i think things have gotten so bad inside iraq, my belief is
that we will, in fact, be greeted as liberators. >> with that expectation they, of course, did not anticipate this endless war there. >> i think some people did. i think that those for whom this war was going to be, a quote, cake walk, they were not looking to the future. they were not looking to the people of iraq. they were looking to the u.s. goal of remaking the middle east in their own image. something that they had been trying to do for a very long time. that is not what happens to the people of iraq. for the same reason that you can't bomb extremism out of existence, you can't bomb bad conditions in a country out of existence. the bombing makes it worse. it made it worse in iraq. it's making it worse in syria, it's making it worse everywhere the u.s. is using bombs to go after extremism.
at the end of the day, bombs don't fall of extremism. they fall on cities, they fall on people. they fall on families. they fall on lives and they destroy those lives. >> phyllis bennis, thank you very much for joining us tonight. >> thank you. coming up, bill o'reilly has a crazy new idea about how to fight the war in iraq and syria, and next, charles blow joins me with the amazing stories of his life that are contained in his brilliant new book.
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>> in the spotlight tonight, charles blow. i know a lot of you think you know a lot about his articles in "the new york times," but you don't know nothing about charles until you've read his beautiful new book "fire shut up in my bones" which is called a brave, powerful memoir. now, when i was on the injured list here for a couple of months and ari filled in for me on the show, i completely unplugged. i discovered the quiet serenity of no tv, no movies and no books. i told friends i did nothing all day and then suddenly i was having dinner. friends sent me dvds, they sent me books. i would glance at them and put
them aside and then charles sent me this book. it's his first book of what i'm sure will be many. and remembering across the decades to the excitement and anticipation of getting my first and only book published, i thought well, i owe it to charles to take a look at this thing. and by the time i was a few pages in, i knew i was holding a literary masterpiece in my hands. consider this from page 7. >> by the time i came along, my mother was a dutiful wife growing dead-as tired of working on a dead-end marriage and a dead-end job. my father was a construction worker by trade, a pool shark by habit and a serial philander by compulsion. my father was short, for a man with a child's play thing for a man -- spinner. he had flawless dark brown skin and a head full of big, wet-looking curls black as oil. and he had a smile of a scoundrel, the kind of smile that disarmed men and undressed women.
charles blow, you know how to hook a reader. these characters from your family to your others all the by through here. these portraits are all painted with that kind of just beautiful literary touch all the way through. >> thank you. i really appreciate that. i was trying as best i could capture these people that i had known my entire life. and to capture them the way that baldwin said -- i tried to remember how i must have spoken as a child. and to remember how i would have described someone top someone that i knew. and to capture that cadence and that beat of southern story telling, and to put that into the book and bring those people alive so you saw them the way i saw them. >> and it is all there. it's one of the reasons why "the new york times" compared this to james baldwin's first novel. >> which scares me, by the way.
>> but it deserves its place on the shelf of great american literature. great african-american literature. great southern literature. it is such an important and wonderful book. and in so many categories. i just want to keep letting the book talk, is that okay? >> absolutely. >> because this aunt odessa. and i love her so much. she was a favorite was aunt odessa, a small loquacious woman with deeply wrinkled skin and hair jutting out every which way. she lived around the corner from papa joe's place in a small three-room house unpainted. silver and warped with decay. her house had no bathroom, no plumbing, and no gas heating. she retrieved water from an outside pump and bathed in a wash tub. she went to the bathroom in a slop jar and ferried its contents to a spot out back. but when she died, i was told
that $16,000 in cash was found in the freezer section of her refrigerator double and triple wrapped in wonder bread bags. >> yes. >> and this is, let's remember 1980 we're talking? ronald reagan is president while this woman, your aunt has no plumbing in her house, none of these things. >> right. and i think that, you know, trying to capture what rural poverty looks like. >> yes. >> very often, when we talk about the poor in this country, we're talking about, you know, we use the euphemisms of inner city and concrete steps and high rise project buildings. and of course, that is part of the portrait of poverty in america, but what is left out of that portrait is how people live and survive in poverty apart from cities. and there are a lot of those people out there. and their stories do not get told.
and i wanted to tell those stories. in this book. >> and there's poverty all over this book. you are -- in the world you're living in, you're not down there with aunt odessa, you have a tv. >> my mom always jokes about it. i got to high school and i said i didn't realize we were poor. >> here's another part of it. this book is filled with joy. this kid, charlotte blow, is filled with joy while there's all this deprivation around him. you're not thinking of this as a deprived childhood. >> not necessarily. i think that is kind of the beauty of being a child. and it's also the beauty of kind of the plight of poverty, which is that you find small shreds of joy among the shrapnel. anticipate that's what i was doing. >> okay, here is an amazing small shred of joy. here is a passage where you talk
about you and your brothers. when my brothers and i finished our digging in the junk yard, we climbed into the ditch across the street and dug for a treat. we flaked off pieces of edible clay dirt that smelled to me like dry earth at the beginning of a fresh rain and tasted like chalk soaked in vinegar. folks said it was good for you. settled your stomach, staved off illness. all i knew was the taste was addictive and that ditch where the curve of the road cut deep into the ground and exploez posed the strata was the only place in town where that dirt could be found. best of all, it was free. >> yes. >> now, over there at the fancy new york times cafeteria at lunch, do you guys talk much about eating dirt? >> i think i should package it and sell it or something like that. fancy packaging. >> yeah.
but again, that's the part of the point about, someone read a passage like oh, my god, charles was eating dirt. but this is not one of the unpleasant passages in the book. there are some incredible firsts in this book. actually, i would like you to read one to us that i've highlighted if for you. it's kind of one of the not good firsts in your life that you'll remember. >> in gibbsland, our racial role playing was subtle and sophisticated. we had an unknown understanding. we simply danced around each other, moving to a tune that everyone knew but no one sang. warm smiles, sharing space with cold stares. public platitudes dissolve into the ugly things that found voice behind closed doors. if people learned to hate, they also learned to hide it.
i never heard or saw anything overtly unpleasant in public, that is until the first time i was called a nigger. >> the first time. >> the first time. >> that's the first time. childhood is filled with first time. that's the first time that most of us have never had. and it seems to me that in today's america, it's a first time that most of us who never had it are not trying to imagine. >> right. and it's up with of those proving moments in our life where you -- you realize -- you're awakened to something. you grew up three years in three seconds. where it utterly alters you and you realize that the world as you knew it is not quite as simple as you thought it was. and that there are people who hate you. and there's nothing that you can do about that. and you now have to learn to negotiate those situations and learn to re-evaluate how you
thought you were negotiating life and negotiating the relationships with the people around you. >> and in your town gibbsland, which is where bonnie and clyde famously got caught in the end and shot. that's the claim to fame. that's the only time it appeared on the movies. >> or on "jeopardy." >> it was on "jeopardy"? but in the cemetery there, there is still a fence between -- still. 2014, a fence between black and white in the cemetery. >> the way it's set up is there's two separate cemeteries. you can take that how you want to take that. it seems to me that you could do a lot of good by just taking the chain link fence that separates the white graves from the black ones. >> you tell a story here about being pulled over in a car by a police officer and not for any
good reason that you could understand, you guys in the car were wondering what the reason was. and the officer was very, kind of harsh about it. and at a certain point, he said -- i'm going to read from the book. he said, i will never forget, that if he wanted to, he could make us lie down in the middle of the road and shoot us in the back of the head and no one would say anything about it. with that, he walked back to his car and drove away. not the rest of us who have been pulled over and seen the cop walk back and drive away. it's not after hearing something like that. >> that's right. and a lot of black men in america have really kind of horror stories experiences. they may be different. but it's hard to find another
black man particularly of my age who has lived this long, four decades in america, who hasn't had some negative experience with a police officer. and, you know, i'm thinking, this cannot be. we're the good guys. we're the college students. we didn't even do anything wrong. why did you even pull us over? and the psychological scars that that leaves on a kid, which is why i -- you know, i keep trying to get people to understand with things like stop and frisk. people say oh, it's not that big of a deal. they let them go. they haven't done anything wrong. no, there's a psychological scar that follows that. that is really hard to shake. it's hard for me to shake that experience now. let alone to be stopped and frisked eight or nine or 12 times in one year. >> and in your public commentary
as you've done on this program. also cases like jordan davis, trayvon martin, these kinds of thing, that kind of experience is in your bank. when you are in the public debate about this, and yet it's kind of difficult, it seems to me, to be able to use it effectively, explicitly, i guess. >> i try to be very explicit. i try to draw in my biography as much as i can. because i think that is the strength of it. i think that coming from a place of authority. i am the authority of me. i know this experience, this lived experience better than anyone. and so when something intersects with that i am very, you know, quick to make sure that people understand. >> can you say we will do a very last word we will read online and read the passage about your first kiss. the happiest first in that book and it is amazing. we'll do more online. coming up in "the rewrite" stephen colbert exposes bill o'reilly's very bad idea. and later, which politician is trying to get your attention while you're watching your favorite tv show?
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>> with the u.s. now unleashing air strikes in syria and building a coalition against isis, fox news host bill o'reilly is offering his own solution. a new volunteer mercenary army. o'reilly is also here with another provocative idea about one of the most colorful generals, general patten. >> we want to talk about your book, but first, these strikes in syria -- >> see? the introduction led with bill's crazy idea about a mercenary army and mentioned the book second. and then when it's charlie's turn to ask the questions, he drops the book immediately. and goes straight to bill's crazy idea. now, one way you know bill isn't serious about his crazy idea is that he invites so many people on his show to say it's a crazy idea.
>> this is a terrible idea. it's a terrible idea, not just as a practical matter but as a moral matter. it's a morally corrosive idea to try to outsource our national security. we're not going to solve this problem by creating an army of marvels avengers or the guardians of the galaxy. >> your idea you've gone from out of the box to off the wall. >> it could turn into a frankenstein force. >> there's unintended consequence for every bold action. you it doesn't mean you don't try. >> he's just using them for batting practice for when he has to go on to other shows and talk about his crazy idea. but when stephen colbert went after o'reilly's crazy idea, o'reilly had to respond because bill knew an exchange with stephen would get much more attention than just batting around one of his nutty ideas on fox news. >> people like stephen colbert
mocking the plan. they don't know anything. but by being completely vacant, it doesn't stop these people from mocking ideas that might have some value. might solve some complex problems. mr. colbert and others of his ilk have no bleeping clue how to fight the jihad. >> that's outrageous. bill o'reilly has to do his own bleeping? come on, rupert murdoch, spring for the bleep machine. i've got one right here. watch. bill o'reilly is a [ bleep ] egomaniac. now, i am sure, i am absolutely positive that was beeped for broadcast because i don't mean it. but more importantly, how can bill ame and others of my ilk don't have a clue how to fight jihad. bill, baby doll, you're of my
ilk. we're ilk mates. we're members of the same ilk lodge. we dip our cookies in the same glass of ilk. i wasn't mocking your plan. i'm the only one who likes it. >> judging by o'reilly's command of the best seller list, steven colbert is not the only one who likes bill o'reilly's books. but bill o'reilly's readers don't know what they're missing. they think they're reading history books, but what they're missing is the actual history. in his new book about world war ii general george patten, o'reilly mention nothing of his vicious anti-semitism. not one word. i don't know this from actually reading the o'reilly book because it's an o'reilly book,
so why would i ever read it. but we can thank richard cohen at "the washington post" for doing the work of plowing through the 352 pages, including the thin index to confirm that o'reilly left out this particular character detail about his latest hero. and richard cohen's column and not in bill o'reilly's book about patent, you can learn why he decided to keep jews in prison camps after the war instead of liberating them. patton wrote in his diary, if they were not kept under guard, they would not stay in the camps, would spread over the country like locusts and would eventually have to be rounded up after quite a few of those had been shot and quite a fur germans murdered and pillaged. at least twice in his diary, patton referred to the jewish displaced persons as animals. earl harrison, the dean of the pennsylvania law school
inspected the camps patton ran and wrote a report for president truman saying, as matters now stand, we appear to be treating the jews as the nazis treated them, except that we do not exterminate them. they're in concentration camps in large numbers under our military guard instead of ss troops. one is led to wonder whether the german people seeing this are not supposing that we are following, or at least condoning nazi policy. richard cohen tells us, here is what patton thought about harrison. harrison and his ilk believe that the displaced person is a human being, which he is not. and this applies particularly to jews who are lower than animals. richard cohen points out that these passages of general patton's letters and diaries are actually in one of the books cited by bill o'reilly as one of the sources for his book but
none of patton's own words about jews made it into o'reilly's pretend history book. but you don't get to be bill o'reilly if you don't have an answer for everything. and so after richard cohen's column appeared, bill o'reilly read an e-mail on his show about a happy reader about patton's anti-semitism. the answer was, there was plenty we left out about patton because the narrative was tight. o'reilly's words. the narrative was tight. now, tight narrative is not what o'reilly's pretend history books are known for. and i actually tested the tightness of the narrative this way. i, first of all, bought the book. you're welcome, bill. and then, just like this, i dropped it open on my desk. i rigged it this time to open up to this page. it randomly opened to page 136
and i promise you, i promise you, i did not search for this. it was the first thing my eye hit in the tight narrative of bill o'reilly's book. because i knew his book on any page would have something that worked here. but this is what's on page 136. hitler stares at the battle maps spread atop the long rectangular conference table in his underground command post. he stops now and then to nibble on the molasses filled labuken or something or other german word that temporarily ceases his insatiable sweet tooth. there's actually a foot net for the word lebuken, a baked treat, much like a ginger bread cookie. then there's another longer footnote on the same page under that. and look at the ginger bread cookie footnote. it doesn't even fill an entire line on this page.
there was room right there to add, general patton, coincidentally agreed with hitler that jews were lower than animals. worst case scenario, you could just drop the line about the molasses-filled cookie and stick in the line that jews are lower than animal in its place. if you really, really needed to keep the word count exactly as it is now. and if what patton actually said about jews was in this book, then the distinguished author could go on tv and talk about patton's crazy ideas instead of his own. ♪ there's confidence... then there's trusting your vehicle maintenance to
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for some strange reason, a very attractive show for republican political advertisers. "the post" found some things that seem to make sense and some that are inexplicable and for the inexplicable, we turn to, of course, the last word's senior analyst of the inexplicable judith freed lander. judah, we see a gay marriage ceremony, and in some market, you immediately go to a republican campaign commercial because why? >> i think it's probably just because it such a high-rated show. i really don't think any of these politicians are trying to sway people and change their vote. i think they're just going after people reminding them to vote who already subscribe to their ideology. >> here's the thing i get.
on reruns, syndicated comedies, andy griffith, "seinfeld," "friends," republicans advertise more on andy griffith than they do on "seinfeld" or "friends." okay, i think we get that. and then in daytime talk, for example, dr. phil is the king. he's where all the republican ads want to go. dr. phil. who do you suppose their least favorite spot for the day? for republican ads. >> maybe ellen. >> exactly. and steve harvey. >> that makes sense. i think that's what we have in america is like, you know n this great land of opportunity, freedom and capitalism we basically have two choices. and, you know, it's basically do you want -- if you need to pick something up at the store, do you go to cvs or walgreens? there's two parties that shall's it.
there's all these shows and two parties. neither one is trying to sway the other except on modern family. >> you know right double play the middle is the game shows. "price is right" is pretty even. "wheel of fortune" is pretty even. >> maybe that's because people who watch game shows are more willing to gamble, take a chance. >> this is the most apolitical venue is a game show. there's no leaning one way or the other. >> maybe they're more open minded. these are people into playing games. >> and also possibly more undecided voters there. therefore, if we go into their game show, we might be able to get them into the election. >> maybe they're not interested in politicians. maybe they just want to win cars. >> tomorrow night, judah will be at caroline's on broadway. he'll be there saturday night, too. we're going to stay here and figure this out. thank you very much.
> fear factor. let's play "hardball." >> good evening, i'm chris matthews up in new york. people only truly believe what they discover for themselves. they believe what they see, what becomes obvious to them. right now, it's obvious that ebola is not being kept from this country. it's here despite the promises we keep getting. how did that man get onto the plane? and why was he sent away from the hospital in dallas when he said he was here from west africa, where we know there's an epidemic of ebola. he walked in carrying some of the symptoms. who and what are we to believe right now? the claim that there was a solid screening system in place at the